(no subject)

[the_rck]

I do not like the new user agreement for LJ. There are things in it that I'm simply not willing to sign on for. Sadly, unless I do, I can't access LJ at all, so I can't respond to comments or read PMs there. I'm not sure if it will stop me cross posting or not.

If you're on DW and I haven't followed you there and/or given you access, please let me know so that I can do that. You can reach me at Gmail as theredck, and I will keep cross posting as long as I can. Since I can't get into LJ, I don't think I can turn off comments there, but please don't comment there as I won't have the option to reply.

If you aren't on DW and want to keep in touch, email is viable for me. Just drop me a line.

ETA: And cross posting is not possible without signing the agreement. Um. No.

Comments

[kaffy_r]

It will stop you from cross-posting. Although I think I could access LJ while signed out, I wouldn't be able to see my friends' locked posts. But at least I might get an idea about other peoples' reactions to this. Like you, I'm not at all sure I want to sign this, even if, as some people say, LJ could already subject me to some of things I don't like in the new agreement. I'm waiting to get more information on this.

[the_rck]

I'm thinking that I may sign so that I can post a departure announcement and delete my content (after backing up to DW to save the comments).

Maybe change the contact email on the account to a burner address when I do that? I don't know. I don't want to delete my account altogether for at least a couple of weeks.

[retsuko]

What's in it that's objectionable?

[the_rck]

For one thing, you're agreeing that they can send you any sort of ads they want, including third party ads unrelated to the service, at the address you give them.

For another, the English language version isn't legally binding on the company. If you sign, you're agreeing to whatever the Russian language version actually says. I haven't been able to get Google translate to do anything at all with that-- It keeps giving me errors.

There's something about legal repercussions for copyright violations if your post gets more than a certain threshold number of visits in 24 hours. The threshold is pretty high, so I'm not worried about it, but it might affect communities.

It also stipulates that anything considered inappropriate for children under Russian law must be labeled as adult content. If I understand correctly, that includes any sort of acknowledgment that queer people exist.

[retsuko]

>:( Dammit. I guess LJ is well and truly dying.

[the_rck]

Yeah. If the terms are sketchy enough for *me* to object, it's pretty bad.

[gehayi]

Could you provide a link, please? I co-mod a community over at LJ.

[the_rck]

This is what I could find in English. The first two links are small articles that seem to address parts of the statute. The third is a master's thesis that's more than 80 pages long. I haven't delved into that beyond making sure it's in English.

http://www.wipo.int/wipolex/en/details.jsp?id=15806
http://www.wipo.int/wipolex/en/details.jsp?id=14090
http://lup.lub.lu.se/luur/download?func=downloadFile&recordOId=1555285&fileOId=1563608

The threshold number for problems is 3000 visitors a day. Is there anything on LJ, in English, beyond the various ONTD communities that gets that much traffic?

The English language version of the agreement is here: http://www.livejournal.com/legal/tos-en.bml You can look at it not logged in (and if you are logged in, you don't get the sign this or else pop up while you're there). There's a link from that to the Russian language version.

The English version isn't all that long but seems to be about the same length as the Russian.

[kalloway]

I haven't gotten a notif for it yet. What are the points of contention?

[the_rck]

The things I object to are:

For one thing, you're agreeing that they can send you any sort of ads they want, including third party ads unrelated to the service, at the address you give them.

For another, the English language version isn't legally binding on the company. If you sign, you're agreeing to whatever the Russian language version actually says. I haven't been able to get Google translate to do anything at all with that-- It keeps giving me errors.

There's something about legal repercussions for copyright violations if your post gets more than a certain threshold number of visits in 24 hours. The threshold is pretty high, so I'm not worried about it, but it might affect communities.

It also stipulates that anything considered inappropriate for children under Russian law must be labeled as adult content. If I understand correctly, that includes any sort of acknowledgment that queer people exist.

I'm most worried about the first item and the fourth.

[kalloway]

Thanks. I'm going to have to agree in order to get in and clear out some things, including about 4000 Scrapbook pictures, but at some point after that, I imagine I'll nuke my account or delete everything aside from an arrow pointing over here.

[the_rck]

That's pretty much what I think I'm going to end up doing. I'm just not going to start tonight because I have a medical thing overnight that starts in an hour.

I was going to stop going there but still crosspost, but LJ won't accept the crosspost unless you agree to the new terms first, so... No.

[kyrielle]

And 6.2-6.3 seems to say they'll keep your data for a year after deletion in case the Russian authorities require it under provision of law. Ugh.

[lily_everhart]

Seriously? Crap. I just deleted.

[lily_everhart]

Not being able to cross post is what tipped me off that something was up on LJ. I have been logging into DW and posting here and not bothering with LJ lately.

I ended up signing the agreement and deleting my account.

[the_rck]

I'm having to stick around a while because of a fic challenge commitment. I'm slowly deleting my old entries, working from 2002 forward (I'm in 2009 now).

I don't like change, but there's a point when I have to move on.

[lily_everhart]

I didn't have much to move. I backed up my first journal I made on LJ in 2002-ish in 2011 when I left the first time. For my latest journal that I made in 2007 I backed it up a few weeks before they announced the server change to Russia. So I just decided to delete it.

I'm not super fond of change. That's why even though I had mostly moved away from LJ from 2011-2015 I still had an LJ account. I honest thought I'd have an account on LJ forever. Also I kind of hoped people would come back eventually. A couple years ago there was a lot of talk on tumblr to do that, but moving to Russia probably killed any movement towards that. It's probably early to bail to be honest. I think LJ will be fine for a little longer. I just really didn't like having to sign that TOS and I've been posting mainly here.

[ayebydan]

It blows my mind that people are like 'eh whatever' to it. I couldn't put together a proper post to say 'hey this is what is wrong' so I just did my 'well, this is my dw' but damn.

[the_rck]

I couldn't write a good explanation, either, but as I read the TOS, I kept feeling like things were piling up. There isn't one thing that pushed me over the edge; it's the weight of the whole.

I did notice that a lot of people who're upset are focused on things that I consider pretty irrelevant or more or less boilerplate. Mostly the stuff they'll only hit you with if some post gets more than 3000 visitors in a 24 hour period.

[kyrielle]

I am really, really amazed that more people who tolerated the rest of it didn't boil over at "we can email you third-party ads though". that's not my biggest worry about it but it's straight-up annoying.